Rob preaching at the mass resignation. Picture from ABC 4 News Utah.
The beginning of last month, the LDS Church announced that they were not allowing kids under 18 years old with a parent involved in a same-sex marriage to be blessed or baptized. This drew world-wide attention with many upset at what appeared to be the Church specifically discriminating against gay couples and taking it out on their kids.
Not long after this, I primarily preached to a bunch of secularists leaving the LDS Church at another mass resignation from the LDS Church. In contrast to last summer’s event, last month had thousands of more people who attended. It was held in the City Creek Park, right across from the Church Office Building in downtown Salt Lake City. Here’s just one news story on the topic.
As soon as I got there, I dialogued with a gay Mormon for about 15 minutes. He was sad that so many were leaving the “only true Church.” He was holding up some sign and dressed like one of their missionaries. He wanted to reassure people that Mormons like himself still loved them no matter what their decision was. He thought I was full of hate because I encouraged him to repent of following false prophets who teach a false god, false Jesus, false spirit, and false gospel. He got so upset, he left to stand at another corner across the street. That worked out well, since I got the best corner where everyone came!
I got out around 70 Jesus Christ/Joseph Smith DVDs, but most weren't open to taking it. They saw my sign and figured I was simply preaching to the choir. “Of course Joseph lied!” However, I made it clear to them that they needed Christ, not a false religion, and not skepticism or atheism. I was able to get into several dialogues with people and I also did some preaching, but overall, people were just as closed-minded, if not more, than committed LDS members.
I told one guy that he should at least be interested in studying why Christianity claims he’s headed to hell if he doesn’t repent. However, he simply assumed I was trying to pull Pascal’s Wager on him and quickly dismissed me. This Wager basically says that if God doesn’t exist, then you have nothing substantial to lose by believing in Him, but if He does exist, then you have everything to lose if you don’t believe in Him. I think that’s prudent, especially given a background in which the evidence may even be as low as 50/50 one way or another. However, I wasn’t advocating anything but simply being open-minded enough to examine Christianity’s claims. I was simply trying to give him a little incentive to challenge his lack of belief.
It was very disappointing to see an old friend with her "wife." Many years ago, I had a part to play in getting my friend out of Mormonism and becoming a Christian. She even went to a Christian church with me for a while. We lost touch with each other and later I heard she became Mormon again. However, here she was resigning again at the mass resignation. I asked if this was going to be her last time to resign, and she said, "Yes, because the LDS Church doesn't like me having a wife." I said, "Well Jesus doesn't like it either." She got quiet and waited for the light to turn. I said, "Jesus died for all your sins, and this is how you thank Him? You need to live for Jesus and not your wife." Neither my friend nor her wife said anything to me as they walked across the street.
In the video I took of the event, one older guy confronted me on eunuchs being born that way in Matthew 19 as a reference to homosexuality being acceptable. I'm still wondering how eunuchs, who can't go either way by definition, are identified as homosexuals. Further, rulers employed eunuchs to watch over their women, since everyone knew they could never be a sexual threat.
The last guy in the video confronted me on 1) Jesus not being a historical person and 2) the original autographs of the Bible aren't in existence and thus, the Bible can't be trusted.
1) The evidence for the historical person of Jesus of Nazareth is overwhelming. Basically no serious historian doubts this. Cornelius Tacitus, Lucian of Samosata, Suetonius, Pliny the Younger, Thallus, Phlegon, Mara Bar-Serapion, the Babylonian Talmud, Josephus, the Apostles, Luke, and the early Church Fathers are all ancient authorities who testified on the existence of Jesus. To doubt Jesus’ historical existence makes as much sense as doubting the existence of Socrates. Neither figure wrote anything that was passed down, but no one doubts their existence due to the fact of what others have written down about them.
2) Just because we don't have the original writings of the Bible doesn't entail you can't trust any of it. We trust it on the basis of the proximity from the originals to the earliest manuscripts as well as the general consistency of all the manuscripts we have. Both these components are *far* better than any other ancient work where the originals are missing (e.g., Illiad, Odyssey, Nicomachean Ethics, etc., etc.). So if you want to throw out the Bible since we don't have the originals, you also have to throw out all ancient works which don't have original writings from their authors. Yeah, good luck with that!
It was no coincidence that Mary Hilding shared last month. We had planned the event months ago, but had no idea how appropriate the timing would be. Mary is not only a former Mormon, but she’s also out of the gay lifestyle. Now she’s living for Jesus! You can see the pictures of our fellowship here and the video testimony here.
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Lets be honest for a minute. This has never been about children of same sex parents. It's because people won't listen to Gods word. Does anyone really think the Prophet and his advisors sat around a table one evening asking what else can be done to harass homosexuals? This decision came directly from God himself.
My goal is to get to the faith, courage and lack of fear u have Rob Sivulka, stand in front of the LDS temple to warn the blind with no fear. wow I am impressed with your courage. Thank you
Had lunch today with a friend from YoungLife and was told another friend of theirs is getting baptized in the Mormon Church next year. To help a friend make a better decision, I referred them to the MormonInfo.org site as a homework assignment. Praying for these people now...
I have been on my own journey finding Christ and my heart tells me in order to fully heal from the deep damage from the lds church and my own family i need a support group.
I have seen several mormonInfo.org videos and wonder if any of these people meet on a regular basis to help others coming out.
Thank you sincerely
[I replied:] Yes we do... Please read www.MeetTheExMormons.org and please Follow the site and RSVP for our next fellowship on the 12th.
How much money do you make with this website? Or at least, with this article.? Why don't you also write about the revelations that really came true, just to play fair a little? RM Sivulka, I would like to know about what you have done in your life before giving credit to your writings.
[In reference to our last fellowship:] Really terrific testimony and company. Delicious food. Thank you everyone and especially Rob and Tara.
Honestly, why would you create such a website? It's not only offensive to us ( Mormons), but you're preaching false doctrines & making a website based on 'Mormonism'..It just goes to show there are low live people in this word, extremely jealous of the hard work and effort put into our beautiful gospel, that yous have nothing else to do but to put our gospel down.. Seriously? You obviously have nothing better to do then to type rubbish on this website..Think & write whatever you want on your website.. But those strong members of the gospel will look past your lies and deceitfulness & know that our gospel is true to it's standards, responsibilities, priorities and authorities.
How would you recommend I lead a Mormon I know to Christ.
…Do they get excommunicated if they don't go on a 2 year missionary tour?
What do you suggest?
[I replied:] Well if [the father] doesn't want to talk with you anymore, it sounds like all you can do is pray for him. If you're referring to [his son] and he is willing to talk, you can pass my site along to him and ask him what he thinks of it. Ask him why he would think Mormonism is true when it seems to clearly go against what the Bible has always taught. Ask him if he knows that Mormonism has been proven false and show him why. Ask him why he thinks his testimony is really from God rather than his own flesh, Satan, or even God allowing him to pursue rebellion (2 Thes. 2:11). Tell him that you're good practice before he goes on his mission and is forced to talk to a lot more like you.
They don't excommunicated if they don't go, but they still expect them (especially the guys) to go.
[He replied:] What do you mean by "Tell him that you're good practice before he goes on his mission and is forced to talk to a lot more like you." Not sure what you are referring to.
And by the way, a well entrenched Mormon of 50 years is not so easy to convince of anything. Is there lie 2 or 3 best techniques for such a one?
[I replied:] You being a Christian are good for him practicing the defense of his LDS faith, since he'll be doing that quite a bit on his mission.
There is no silver bullet, and again, if the guy doesn't want to talk with you, then God's got to open His eyes and ears. So pray for that and love your friend the best you can. Perhaps God will grant him repentance leading to the knowledge of the truth (2 Tim. 2:25). Wait for God's timing while you watch, pray, and love.
I wanted to offer a sincere THANK YOU for your effort in fighting the good fight! It is so refreshing to see how many Christians are out there, doing God's work and spreading Truth. Thank you, thank you, thank you!!!
I recently came across your dad's testimony on you tube. Beautiful. I think the world of him! You should post more on there too. I watched your video on the differences between the mormons and Christian beliefs several times. Post more!
We're standing with you, and all you do up there in Utah!
Holding you up in prayer,
I think your energy would be better spent battling Isis or pornography or many other ills rather than on battling these commandment keeping, Gahndi like souls, But then you probably think Gahndi is going to hell too. Oh well at least when Donny and Marie are in hell the music will be sweet and wholesome., Maybe the devil will convert!:) Seriously, we should all be as sinful as the Mormons. The world would be a far better place.
I love what you’re doing & I fully believe you’re pleasing the Lord with all you & your family are doing to get His TRUTH out to the Mormons. You are so good at that. As I’ve said before, IF THE LORD WANTS YOU TO DO SOMETHING IN PARTICULAR, HE WILL PROVIDE THE MEANS. He always has, always will—He’s committed to it & I praise Him for that.